February 1996 Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:17:46 --100 From: janssen@pucky.uia.ac.be (Pascal F. J. Janssens) Message-Id: <9602041617.AA05614@pucky.uia.ac.be> To: genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: GEDCOM V5.5 spec Content-Length: 285 Hello, Some time ago one of you mentioned the following: "The V5.5 spec is found at genealogy.org ftp server. And it is NOT a draft." I have been seraching for it but without result. Does someone know the exact location of this piece of information. Thanks in advance, Pascal/ From: Jeff Murphy To: "'GenWeb mailing list'" Subject: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 19:24:43 -0800 Encoding: 41 TEXT I would like to suggest that all producers of html generators get together and provide support for the following: 1. Family Group Sheet 2. Pedigree Chart - 5 generations 3. Descendancy Chart - 5 generations 4. Gedcom file, ascending or descending, up to 5 generations The advantage to the GenWeb user is obvious: the data gets transferred to them directly, is easier to use, and eliminates the need to go directly to the database owner to obtain. The disadvantages are fairly obvious, too: more work for the computers storing the data, lots of new programming, need for agreement on format. So, here's what I propose. First off, you guys have to agree that such an addition is desirable. No point (or at least, not from the GenWeb point of view) in one person implementing this by themselves. Then, you have to agree on the formats. While it is probably more fun and all to create your own favorite layouts, it will cause a lot less problems in the long run if one agrees to develop common layouts. Now, the mechanism. Obviously, you don't want to generate this stuff in real time. How about if, when the user selects/requests, say, a gedcom file, the information is passed via a mail message, processed by some kind of, er, processor, and the results returned to them via email with a file attach? Lot's to think about. Jeff Murphy Redmond, Oregon jmurphy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~jmurphy/ for Muhlenberg Co., KY genealogy subscribe to PAFHELP-L at majordomo@teleport.com Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 21:03:10 -0500 From: Gene Stark Message-Id: <199602050203.VAA02296@starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu> To: janssen@pucky.uia.ac.be (Pascal F. J. Janssens) Cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU In-reply-to: janssen@pucky.uia.ac.be's message of Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:17:46 --100 Subject: GEDCOM V5.5 spec References: <4f39dv$1m4@starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu> > Some time ago one of you mentioned the following: > > "The V5.5 spec is found at genealogy.org ftp server. And it is NOT > a draft." > > I have been seraching for it but without result. Does someone know the > exact location of this piece of information. I didn't find it at the above place. It can definitely be found at: ftp.gedcom.org I picked it up from there a few weeks ago. - Gene Stark From: Scott McGee Received: by wales id ; Sun, 4 Feb 96 23:57:57 CST Date: Sun, 4 Feb 96 23:57:57 CST Message-Id: <9602050557.AA02229@wales> To: jmurphy@teleport.com Subject: Re: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms Cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU Jeff, Your ideas look good at first, but let me through a little cold water from experience on them and lets see what comes out of the results. First, most genweb pages out on the net are static and can only return what is stored. The individual page with marriages and children seems much more common than the family group sheet, and actually presents the same information as all family group sheets for a given individual would. Family group sheets would increase storage quite a bit. You suggest three generation pedigree charts and five generation descendant charts. I would suggest that based on what I have seen with my server that the numbers should be the other way around. I present five generations in my pedigree charts and they are usually one or two pages, but some of my three generation descendant charts are four or five pages Actually, I would have little trouble processing these reports in real time, and suspect that others with CGI based systems could do so too. The GEDCOM request presents several problems. First, many people don't mind sharing their data, but for one reason or another, would not want the GEDCOM availible. "Copy what you want from the generated reports, but don't try to add my database to your as a shortcut" seems to be the feeling. Also, how do you specify what set of GEDCOM records to actually return. If you ask for a GEDCOM file starting with me, do you want my wife? My Children? My wife's ancestory, and how many generations? I assume my parents, but what of my siblings and their spouses? My uncles and aunts by blood? By marriage? My cousins? I am afraid that GEDCOM (other than just the individual themself) would indeed require offline return (email) to acomplish, but that might be a problem for some sites too. Just a point of note here, my server actually responds to GEDCOM requests. They are just like an individual request, except the final command is "GEDCOM" and not "LookupIndividual". It will return the GEDCOM entry for just that one person. No FAM records. Scott GENEALOGY | Do you know who your ancestors are? | Scott McGee -----------+---------------------------------------+--------------------- email: smcgee@microware.com | What? Me speak for web: http://genealogy.org/~smcgee/homepage.html | someone else? Nah! ---------------------------------------------------+--------------------- See my genealogy page at http://genealogy.org/~smcgee and my GenWeb page at http://genealogy.org/~smcgee/genweb Message-ID: <01BAF1D3.AFDD0140@ip-bend1-06.teleport.com> From: Jeff Murphy To: "'Scott McGee'" Cc: "genweb@ucsd.edu" Subject: RE: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 01:02:22 -0800 Encoding: 70 TEXT First, most genweb pages out on the net are static and can only return what is stored. The individual page with marriages and children seems much more common than the family group sheet, and actually presents the same information as all family group sheets for a given individual would. Family group sheets would increase storage quite a bit. Right, but I'm not talking about creating and retaining family group sheets before they are requested. My thinking is this: everyone who generates html, whether dynamically in real time, or statically, has to have a gedcom to create them from. My assumption is that data remains somewhere on the computer system. So if a user wanted to see any of the suggested reports, the data exists from which to generate such things. It is only a matter of how to generate them. You suggest three generation pedigree charts and five generation descendant charts. I would suggest that based on what I have seen with my server that the numbers should be the other way around. Sorry, thought I had five generations for both. But regardless, an agreed-upon number is a prerequisite. Kinda like agreeing to the size of the table to end the war in Vietnam. The GEDCOM request presents several problems. First, many people don't mind sharing their data, but for one reason or another, would not want the GEDCOM availible. Well, I can see that. But doesn't that sound like a single byte of data, located somewhere? When they submit the gedcom, they can specify (how about through an online html?) that they do/do not want gedcoms made available from their files. I've run into that thinking myself, but to some of us it is important and to others it makes no sense. how do you specify what set of GEDCOM records to actually return. If you ask for a GEDCOM file starting with me, do you want my wife? My Children? My wife's ancestory, and how many generations? PAF's criteria are my favorite (naturally). The questions are pretty simple: ----------------------- CREATE GEDCOM FILE MENU ----------------------- What records do you want to place in the GEDCOM file first? 1. Ancestors 2. Descendants 3. Family 4. Individual 5. All Family Records Data 6. Range of Families 7. Focus Results 8. Save the GEDCOM File 0. Return to GEDCOM Menu Please enter your selection: Good questions about the range of the gedcom, but again, this all doesn't have to spring from my head full-blown, does it? Maybe someone else has some ideas? Jeff Murphy Redmond, Oregon jmurphy@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~jmurphy/ for Muhlenberg Co., KY genealogy subscribe to PAFHELP-L at majordomo@teleport.com From: Scott McGee Received: by wales id ; Mon, 5 Feb 96 09:34:17 CST Date: Mon, 5 Feb 96 09:34:17 CST Message-Id: <9602051534.AA02462@wales> To: genweb@UCSD.EDU, lines-l@vm1.nodak.edu Subject: My GenWeb site Friends, Last month, I had a bit of an accident and lost many files (not genealogy data, just things like index files and such) and then had to be out of state for two weeks. As a result, when I got back last week, and started fixing things, I am not sure I remembered everything. If you have a few moments to spend online, I would like to ask you to stop by my GenWeb site and browse around. If you find any pages not responding, or with "offline" messages, please let me know. I would also be interested in hearing your opinions on my server. One thing I have changed about it is the indexes. Before, each database had its own index. Some of the larger indexes were too large to download into a browser. I have fixed this by sending index requests to Gene Stark's GenDex page where all my databases, and many more, are indexed. Oh, the JMurphy (now called Murphy) and Mayflower (now called Mayflo7) databases have been updated and contain many more people so you might also want to check out those changes. Thanks in advance Scott GENEALOGY | Do you know who your ancestors are? | Scott McGee -----------+---------------------------------------+--------------------- email: smcgee@microware.com | What? Me speak for web: http://genealogy.org/~smcgee/homepage.html | someone else? Nah! ---------------------------------------------------+--------------------- See my genealogy page at http://genealogy.org/~smcgee and my GenWeb page at http://genealogy.org/~smcgee/genweb From: Scott McGee Received: by wales id ; Mon, 5 Feb 96 09:59:22 CST Date: Mon, 5 Feb 96 09:59:22 CST Message-Id: <9602051559.AA02590@wales> To: genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: RE: Producing Standarized.... Jeff Murphy writes: Jeff, first off, I think I may have sounded a bit critical in my reply to your post. That was not my intention. I just wanted to throw my slant on things to help refine the idea. Sorry if it seemed otherwise. >>First, most genweb pages out on the net are static and can only return >>what is stored. The individual page with marriages and children seems >>much more common than the family group sheet, and actually presents the >>same information as all family group sheets for a given individual would. >>Family group sheets would increase storage quite a bit. > >My thinking is this: everyone who generates html, whether dynamically in >real time, or statically, has to have a gedcom to create them from. My >assumption is that data remains somewhere on the computer system. So if a >user wanted to see any of the suggested reports, the data exists from which >to generate such things. It is only a matter of how to generate them. Unfortunately, if the person is using a static method, they have the choice of either creating and storing EVERY such chart before hand, or creating it by hand on request. Without CGI, they would have no way to dynamically create and return such reports. > >>You suggest three generation pedigree charts and five generation descendant >>charts. I would suggest that based on what I have seen with my server that >>the numbers should be the other way around. > >Sorry, thought I had five generations for both. But regardless, an >agreed-upon number is a prerequisite. Kinda like agreeing to the size of >the table to end the war in Vietnam. Right (I may have gotten the one number wrong anyway), what I wanted to say was that I didn't think five generations was workable for descendant charts, and was suggesting we lower it to three. I like the idea, or I wouldn't be doing it myself already. > >>The GEDCOM request presents several problems. First, many people don't mind >>sharing their data, but for one reason or another, would not want the >>GEDCOM availible. > >Well, I can see that. But doesn't that sound like a single byte of data, >located somewhere? When they submit the gedcom, they can specify (how >about through an online html?) that they do/do not want gedcoms made >available from their files. I've run into that thinking myself, but to >some of us it is important and to others it makes no sense. Yes and no. Most cases could be handled the way you mention, but I have run into some who wouldn't even allow their info on a service that allowed ANY database to be retreived as GEDCOM. > >>how do >>you specify what set of GEDCOM records to actually return. If you ask for a >>GEDCOM file starting with me, do you want my wife? My Children? My wife's >>ancestory, and how many generations? > >PAF's criteria are my favorite (naturally). The questions are pretty >simple: Hmm, doesn't sound too bad, but I don't relish the thought of implementing it. I suspect that something like PAF's 9 generation limit would be needed. > >Good questions about the range of the gedcom, but again, this all doesn't >have to spring from my head full-blown, does it? Nope, not at all. We would all need to discuss it as you and I have done and reach some consensus. I am sure that some of the others here would have some different ideas than you and I. Scott GENEALOGY | Do you know who your ancestors are? | Scott McGee -----------+---------------------------------------+--------------------- email: smcgee@microware.com | What? Me speak for web: http://genealogy.org/~smcgee/homepage.html | someone else? Nah! ---------------------------------------------------+--------------------- See my genealogy page at http://genealogy.org/~smcgee and my GenWeb page at http://genealogy.org/~smcgee/genweb Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:06:39 -0700 (MST) From: "Rex C. Myer" To: "Pascal F. J. Janssens" cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: Re: GEDCOM V5.5 spec In-Reply-To: <9602041617.AA05614@pucky.uia.ac.be> Pascal, It is at: ftp://ftp.gedcom.org/pub/genealogy/gedcom/ and pick your flavor (i.e. PS, WP 5.1, WP 6.2). Cheers, Rex On Sun, 4 Feb 1996, Pascal F. J. Janssens wrote: > Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:17:46 --100 > From: Pascal F. J. Janssens > To: genweb@UCSD.EDU > Subject: GEDCOM V5.5 spec > > Hello, > > Some time ago one of you mentioned the following: > > "The V5.5 spec is found at genealogy.org ftp server. And it is NOT > a draft." > > I have been seraching for it but without result. Does someone know the > exact location of this piece of information. > > Thanks in advance, > Pascal/ > > > Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 22:33:25 -0800 Message-Id: <199602040633.AA00413@foxtrot.rahul.net> X-Sender: svpafug@rahul.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Greg & Andrea Littlefield From: svpafug@rahul.net (Bill Minnick) Subject: Re: Littlefield links Cc: ann.turner@239.microbbs.us.com, CJHARLESS@aol.com, DRZH39A@prodigy.com (MRS CAROL R AUSTIN), SCTS16A@prodigy.com (Claiborne Duval), "Dr. Michael Austin" , eph1@ix.netcom.com, fnordin@ix.netcom.com, Gary Alan Parsons , genweb@UCSD.EDU, junter@hpoemg.sj.hp.com (Jan Unter), jcarlin@pacificnet.net, "Loren Toomsen" , wwfamily@xmission.com, gathman@lava.net, "Timothy B. Doyle" , al.buskirk@239.microbbs.us.com, HSWV55B@prodigy.com (Alice Martin) >Hi, I just wanted to let you all know that I added links from the >Littlefields in your database to their descendants in mine. I will try >to add reverse links (from mine to yours) asap, but for the time being, >I have a link to 'our Austin cousins' on my genealogy page. Thanks for >your time! > >Greg Littlefield >Austin, TX >http://www.eden.com/~gregandi/genealogy.html GREG: This is exactly what I envisioned 10 months ago when I colaborated with Tim Doyle of Dallas, TX to add the "LINK" insertion capability in our Austin and other genealogy pages. Thanks for seizing the opportunity to add to our Richard Austin database by linking in your Littlefield database. This is the next level of the GENWEB concept at work. For those who may not see the impact of this event, Greg has, on his own, and without our intervention, added a link to his Littlefield database into our Richard Austin Database via the automatic LINK feature on every page of Tim Doyle's genealogy databases. With the LINK feature, the simple action of one person, Greg, adds real value for all other researchers to both the Austin and Littlefield databases. This example is a significant new application of the Web that uses the potential of the Web to take publication of genealogy beyond what is possible in the printed book. Thanks, Greg, for following our lead in this evolutionary step in development of the GenWeb concept. Regards, Bill Minnick Austin Web Project NOTE: The Link inserted by Greg can be seeen at URL: http://sillyg.doit.com/cgi-bin/igmget/n=Austin?91907 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:16:27 -0500 From: Gene Stark Message-Id: <199602051816.NAA05876@starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu> To: "Rex C. Myer" CC: genweb@ucsd.edu In-reply-to: "Rex C. Myer"'s message of Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:06:39 -0700 (MST) Subject: Re: GEDCOM V5.5 spec References: >It is at: >ftp://ftp.gedcom.org/pub/genealogy/gedcom/ >and pick your flavor (i.e. PS, WP 5.1, WP 6.2). One thing the old 5.4 draft standard had that the 5.5 standard does not have is an ASCII text version. I got great use out of that one, which I could read in to a text editor and search it for stuff. Is there some reason why the 5.5 standard wasn't distributed in this form? - Gene Stark From list-relay@UCSD.EDU Mon Feb 5 17:49:42 1996 Received: from UCSD.EDU (mailbox2.ucsd.edu [132.239.1.54]) by fuji.ucsd.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA12508 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:49:41 -0800 Received: from upsmot03.msn.com (upsmot03.msn.com [204.95.110.85]) by UCSD.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA21331 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:52:12 -0800 Received: by upsmot03.msn.com id AA10352; Mon, 5 Feb 96 17:49:49 -0800 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 01:44:47 UT From: "Jim Murphy" Message-Id: To: genweb@UCSD.EDU unsubscribe Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:55:14 -0500 (EST) From: Phlete Teachout Subject: Re: GEDCOM V5.5 spec To: Gene Stark Cc: "Rex C. Myer" , genweb@UCSD.EDU In-Reply-To: <199602051816.NAA05876@starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Gene Stark wrote: > One thing the old 5.4 draft standard had that the 5.5 standard does not > have is an ASCII text version. I got great use out of that one, which > I could read in to a text editor and search it for stuff. > > Is there some reason why the 5.5 standard wasn't distributed in this form? No good one - I can guarantee! - fleet - From list-relay@UCSD.EDU Mon Feb 5 20:31:35 1996 Received: from UCSD.EDU (mailbox1.ucsd.edu [132.239.1.53]) by fuji.ucsd.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA12812 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:31:34 -0800 Received: from mail.ucsd.edu (ucsd.edu [132.239.1.1]) by UCSD.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA15960 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:34:17 -0800 Received: from irpsbbs.ucsd.edu by mail.ucsd.edu; id UAA06713 sendmail 8.6.12/UCSD-2.2-sun via SMTP Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:34:10 -0800 for Received: from IRPS BBS (2400014) by irpsbbs.ucsd.edu (PostalUnion/SMTP 1.2) id AA2400014.994000; Mon, 05 Feb 1996 20:37:23 PDT Message-ID: <1996Jan07.130519.994000@irpsbbs.ucsd.edu> To: genweb@UCSD.EDU From: ghoffman@UCSD.EDU (Gary Hoffman) Organization: IR/PS UC San Diego, La Jolla CA 92093-0519 Date: Sun, 07 Jan 1996 13:05:19 PDT Subject: You are tuned to GenWeb-Do not reply Anyone receiving this message is one of over 500 people subscribed to the e-mail mailing list GENWEB. The purpose of this list is to facilitate the development of a linked, worldwide distributed genealogy database. If this topic is not of interest to you ... here is how to unsubscribe: Send an e-mail message to listserv@ucsd.edu In the body of the message put the words: UNSUB GENWEB That's all. Do not reply to this message. Do not send these commands to genweb@ucsd.edu. Do not send me a message about unsubscribing. Just do it as outlined above. If you still want to read about the GenWeb, please point your WWW browser to the URL http://demo.genweb.org/genweblist/genweblist.html All current and archived messages are there for your perusal without cluttering your mailbox. Thanks, Gary *************************************************************************** *Gary B. Hoffman, Computing Services Manager e-mail: ghoffman@ucsd.edu* *Graduate School of International Relations and Pacific Studies (IR/PS)* *University of California, San Diego (UCSD) voice: (619) 534-7733* *9500 Gilman Dr., La Jolla, CA 92093-0519 USA fax: (619) 534-5727* *************************************************************************** Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:11:39 -0500 From: Gene Stark Message-Id: <199602060511.AAA07576@starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu> To: genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: This is my last message to this list This will be my last message to this list, I am sorry to say. After the last one I posted earlier today, I received no less than *thirteen* notices of bounced mail from various sites. It is my opinion that a properly configured mailing list should not cause bounced mail from multiple sites to be returned to the originator of the mail. I am sending the current message from a bogus account, so that I don't get another flood of bounced mail. Gene Stark stark@cs.sunysb.edu From list-relay@UCSD.EDU Mon Feb 5 21:54:17 1996 Received: from UCSD.EDU (mailbox2.ucsd.edu [132.239.1.54]) by fuji.ucsd.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA12879 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:54:16 -0800 Received: from ux7.cso.uiuc.edu (ux7.cso.uiuc.edu [128.174.5.46]) by UCSD.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA28611 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:57:42 -0800 Received: (from e-miner@localhost) by ux7.cso.uiuc.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA147482; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:57:36 -0600 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:57:35 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Anthony Miner To: Gene Stark cc: "Rex C. Myer" , genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: Re: GEDCOM V5.5 spec In-Reply-To: <199602051816.NAA05876@starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Gene Stark wrote: > >It is at: > >ftp://ftp.gedcom.org/pub/genealogy/gedcom/ > >and pick your flavor (i.e. PS, WP 5.1, WP 6.2). > > One thing the old 5.4 draft standard had that the 5.5 standard does not > have is an ASCII text version. I got great use out of that one, which > I could read in to a text editor and search it for stuff. > > Is there some reason why the 5.5 standard wasn't distributed in this form? > > - Gene Stark > Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:57:22 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Anthony Miner To: Gene Stark cc: "Rex C. Myer" , genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: Re: GEDCOM V5.5 spec In-Reply-To: <199602051816.NAA05876@starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Gene Stark wrote: > >It is at: > >ftp://ftp.gedcom.org/pub/genealogy/gedcom/ > >and pick your flavor (i.e. PS, WP 5.1, WP 6.2). > > One thing the old 5.4 draft standard had that the 5.5 standard does not > have is an ASCII text version. I got great use out of that one, which > I could read in to a text editor and search it for stuff. > > Is there some reason why the 5.5 standard wasn't distributed in this form? > > - Gene Stark > From: mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:16:56 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602060616.WAA19125@roxy.sfo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms To: genweb@UCSD.EDU In-Reply-To: <01BAF1A4.23534420@ip-bend1-15.teleport.com> X-Mailer: SPRY Mail Version: 04.00.06.21 Re standard html reports. Roots IV does this already. From: mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:20:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602060620.WAA19299@roxy.sfo.com> Subject: RE: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms To: genweb@UCSD.EDU In-Reply-To: <01BAF1D3.AFDD0140@ip-bend1-06.teleport.com> X-Mailer: SPRY Mail Version: 04.00.06.21 On Sat, 3 Feb 1996, Jeff Murphy wrote: >My thinking is this: everyone who generates html, whether dynamically in >real time, or statically, has to have a gedcom to create them from. No. Roots IV creates them directly from the Roots IV database. Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 03:13:37 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Anthony Miner To: mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: Re: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms In-Reply-To: <199602060616.WAA19125@roxy.sfo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Feb 1996 mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com wrote: > Re standard html reports. Roots IV does this already. > Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 03:14:32 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Anthony Miner To: mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: RE: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms In-Reply-To: <199602060620.WAA19299@roxy.sfo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Feb 1996 mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com wrote: > On Sat, 3 Feb 1996, Jeff Murphy wrote: > >My thinking is this: everyone who generates html, whether dynamically in > >real time, or statically, has to have a gedcom to create them from. > > No. Roots IV creates them directly from the Roots IV database. > > > Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 03:13:56 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Anthony Miner To: mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: Re: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms In-Reply-To: <199602060616.WAA19125@roxy.sfo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Feb 1996 mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com wrote: > Re standard html reports. Roots IV does this already. > Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 03:14:59 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Anthony Miner To: mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU Subject: RE: Producing standardized reports and gedcoms In-Reply-To: <199602060620.WAA19299@roxy.sfo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 5 Feb 1996 mavrogeorge@genealogysf.com wrote: > On Sat, 3 Feb 1996, Jeff Murphy wrote: > >My thinking is this: everyone who generates html, whether dynamically in > >real time, or statically, has to have a gedcom to create them from. > > No. Roots IV creates them directly from the Roots IV database. > > > Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 05:49:55 -0800 To: Graham Kirk From: Peter Lofting Subject: Parish Transcripts & Database Structures Cc: genuki-l@postman.essex.ac.uk, genweb@UCSD.EDU Hello Graham, Re: Parish Transcripts & Database Structures I swa your posting in GenUKI. Hope it goes well and that you get lots of feedback. I'm starting a similar database approach to my searching and the questions you raise are ones that I share. I've built a database of all GRO index entries for Births in my line from 1837 to 1943. The total population of births in the century is only 500, so it is a feasible approach. I'm working backwards so that I tie up all the 19th century lines and can target which parishes to search as they are so much more leg-work. > Is there any standard for the structure that is used > already that I could adopt before I get too far?. I don't know. I'm wondering the same thing. Already I've hit on the issue of multiple sources of the same information (ie. different indexes & docs.) and the need to model each index in its own right, yet at the same time also model the events they represent in a form that allows integration. I'm currently mulling ideas for a GENERIC LIFE EVENT RECORD that can support all event types. The types of event I've thought of supporting are those for which there are formal records. The list so far is: Birth Christening/Baptism Indenture/Apprenticeship Marraige Death Will/Probate Perhaps this could be extended to include ships lists and military service events also, but I don't yet know much about the structure of these records. ** This would be a good subject for on-line collaboration ** Namely to pool information about the data structures of various source record types. From the pooled info we could build a big picture and make a really good database structure that could handle anything. Anybody interested? The generic model I've been thinking of would be on the lines of: EVENT RECORD: Event Type [list as above] Participants [1-to-many relationship] Participant name Participant role [father, mother, husb. wife, infant etc.] Location Address Parish Date Year Month Day Source Doc ref. The main benefit of this basic outline is that it allows all names involved in index entries and certificates to be stored in a PARTICIPANT INDIVIDUALS file where they can be searched. The role information would then allow very interesting searching and comparing of data and inferring of relationships. Just thoughts so far. I haven't ploughed through enough original data to be able to abstract all the details into a real design yet. Have you or anyone else been thinking along these lines? > Has anyone got a good Latin Dictionary on computer that > would help with church records. > I have downloaded one or two from the NET I'd like to ask you for the URLs of the files you downloaded. > but a lot of the words in the records > are missing from the dictionary. The UK Magazine Genealogy Monthly has a feature on manorial rolls and a glossary at the end of unusual terms found in such records. Most are latin words as I recall. I think its issue 6 - the most recent one. Sorry I don't have it to hand to quote from at the moment. Hope this helps. Best wishes Peter Lofting /-----------------------------------------------------------------------\ | | | L A S E R Q U I L L E-Mail: Support@LaserQuill.org | | Database Publishing & Voice-Mail: 00 44 (1753) 830270 24hr | | Multi-Script Computing Fax: 00 44 (171) 831 9489 24hr | | | \-----------------------------------------------------------------------/ Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:26:10 -0600 To: genweb@UCSD.EDU From: ml-helm@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (Matthew Helm) Subject: Survey of World Wide Web Genealogists Recently there have been several surveys which have tried to define the Internet community and its needs and interests, including a survey of the subscribers to Roots-L. I thought it might be useful to do the same for the WWW genealogy community. The purpose of this survey is to find out a little about you by collecting some basic demographic data, as well as determine what products and services you, the genealogy community would like to see online. Any identifying data (such as e-mail addresses) will be stripped away from the survey results so that your confidentiality is maintained. I intend to release a summary of the results within two weeks of the conclusion of the survey. Thank you for your time in filling out the survey and I hope that the results will improve the online services provided to you and others in the genealogy community. The survey may be found at http://ux1.cso.uiuc.edu/~al-helm/survey.html If you have any questions please feel free to email me. Thanks again for your participation. Matthew Helm ml-helm@uiuc.edu Genealogy Toolbox - http://ux1.cso.uiuc.edu/~al-helm/genealogy.html Subject: Re: Parish Transcripts & Database Structures To: Peter Lofting Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:48:21 +0000 (GMT) From: Ben Laurie Cc: kirk@radstone.co.uk, genuki-l@postman.essex.ac.uk, genweb@UCSD.EDU In-Reply-To: from "Peter Lofting" at Feb 6, 96 05:49:55 am Reply-To: ben@algroup.co.uk X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 PGP2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 3976 Message-ID: <9602061648.aa20229@gonzo.ben.algroup.co.uk> > > Hello Graham, > > Re: Parish Transcripts & Database Structures > > I swa your posting in GenUKI. Hope it goes well and that you get lots of > feedback. I'm starting a similar database approach to my searching and the > questions you raise are ones that I share. > > I've built a database of all GRO index entries for Births in my line from > 1837 to 1943. The total population of births in the century is only 500, so > it is a feasible approach. I'm working backwards so that I tie up all the > 19th century lines and can target which parishes to search as they are so > much more leg-work. > > > Is there any standard for the structure that is used > > already that I could adopt before I get too far?. > > I don't know. I'm wondering the same thing. > > Already I've hit on the issue of multiple sources of the same information > (ie. different indexes & docs.) and the need to model each index in its own > right, yet at the same time also model the events they represent in a form > that allows integration. > > I'm currently mulling ideas for a GENERIC LIFE EVENT RECORD that can > support all event types. The types of event I've thought of supporting are > those for which there are formal records. The list so far is: > > Birth > Christening/Baptism > Indenture/Apprenticeship > Marraige > Death > Will/Probate Add inheritance, of both property (places, rights and things) and titles (Lord, Duke, Baron, etc) to this list. > > Perhaps this could be extended to include ships lists and military service > events also, but I don't yet know much about the structure of these > records. > > ** This would be a good subject for on-line collaboration ** > > Namely to pool information about the data structures of various source > record types. From the pooled info we could build a big picture and make a > really good database structure that could handle anything. Anybody > interested? > > The generic model I've been thinking of would be on the lines of: > > EVENT RECORD: > > Event Type [list as above] > > Participants [1-to-many relationship] > Participant name > Participant role [father, mother, husb. wife, infant etc.] > > Location > Address > Parish > > Date > Year > Month > Day > > Source > Doc ref. In the case of property and titles you'd need a reference back to the record describing it (unless you want to make it a pseudo-person, yuk). Ships' lists and military service would also need the same sort of stuff, for the ship, for example. > > The main benefit of this basic outline is that it allows all names involved > in index entries and certificates to be stored in a PARTICIPANT INDIVIDUALS > file where they can be searched. > > The role information would then allow very interesting searching and > comparing of data and inferring of relationships. > > Just thoughts so far. I haven't ploughed through enough original data to be > able to abstract all the details into a real design yet. > > Have you or anyone else been thinking along these lines? > > > > Has anyone got a good Latin Dictionary on computer that > > would help with church records. > > I have downloaded one or two from the NET > > I'd like to ask you for the URLs of the files you downloaded. > > > but a lot of the words in the records > > are missing from the dictionary. > > The UK Magazine Genealogy Monthly has a feature on manorial rolls and a > glossary at the end of unusual terms found in such records. Most are latin > words as I recall. I think its issue 6 - the most recent one. Sorry I don't > have it to hand to quote from at the moment. > > Hope this helps. > > Best wishes > > Peter Lofting -- Ben Laurie Phone: +44 (181) 994 6435 Freelance Consultant Fax: +44 (181) 994 6472 and Technical Director Email: ben@algroup.co.uk A.L. Digital Ltd, URL: http://www.algroup.co.uk London, England. From: "W. Wesley Groleau (Wes)" Subject: ISO-Latin-2 characters in HTML To: lines-L@vm1.nodak.edu, genweb@UCSD.EDU Date: Mon, 12 Feb 96 12:26:18 EST Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] I think it was Rafal who posted this (My comments on the right to save space): 
> ISO 8859-2 (Latin 2) codes for Polish national characters:
>
> ¡  Ą         | I immediately dumped the message to "test.html"
> £  Ł        | try it out.  Most of the characters do NOT work
> ¦  Ś        | in Mosaic.  Are they Netscapisms? or is Mosaic
> ¬  Ź        | just not up to date with respect to "official"
> ¯  Ż          | HTML?
> ±  ą         |
> ³  ł        | My wife is Polish, so if I thought this would
> ¶  ś        | work in general, I'd keep a perl or awk script
> ¼  ź        | to do substitutions in output GEDCOM which is
> ¿  ż          | currently used in a CGI-based GenWeb service.
> Æ  Ć        | (Wouldn't want " Ł " embedded in a name
> Ê  Ę         | to screw up Soundex in my "working" database.)
> Ñ  Ń        |
> Ó  Ó        | P.S. What's the server address to re-subscribe
> æ  ć        | to GenWeb@ucsd.edu ?
> ê  ę
> ñ  ń
> ó  ó
>
-- --------------------------------------------------------------------------- W. Wesley Groleau (Wes) Office: 219-429-4923 Magnavox - Mail Stop 10-40 Home: 219-471-7206 1010 Production Road QuickMail (Mac): wwgrol@most.fw.hac.com Fort Wayne, IN 46808 elm (Unix): wwgrol@pseserv3.fw.hac.com --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 12 Feb 96 21:37:02 +0100 From: Anders Andersson Message-Id: <9602122037.AA24388@Mizar.DoCS.UU.SE> To: wwgrol@pseserv3.fw.hac.com Subject: Re: ISO-Latin-2 characters in HTML Cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU, lines-L@vm1.nodak.edu [GenWeb project group: User Interfaces] W. Wesley Groleau writes: >I think it was Rafal who posted this (My comments on the right to save space): > >
>> ISO 8859-2 (Latin 2) codes for Polish national characters:
>>
>> ¡  Ą         | I immediately dumped the message to "test.html"
>> £  Ł        | try it out.  Most of the characters do NOT work
>> ¦  Ś        | in Mosaic.  Are they Netscapisms? or is Mosaic
>> ¬  Ź        | just not up to date with respect to "official"
>> ¯  Ż          | HTML?

>From RFC 1866, "Hypertext Markup Language - 2.0", section 1.2.1:

   A document is a conforming HTML document if:

[...]

        * Its document character set includes [ISO-8859-1] and
        agrees with [ISO-10646]; that is, each code position listed
        in 13, "The HTML Coded Character Set" is included, and each
        code position in the document character set is mapped to the
        same character as [ISO-10646] designates for that code
        position.

            NOTE - The document character set is somewhat
            independent of the character encoding scheme used to
            represent a document. For example, the `ISO-2022-JP'
            character encoding scheme can be used for HTML
            documents, since its repertoire is a subset of the
            [ISO-10646] repertoire. The critical distinction is
            that numeric character references agree with
            [ISO-10646] regardless of how the document is
            encoded.


You refer to ISO 8859-2, which is not allowed as the "document
character set" of a conforming HTML document, since it doesn't
include ISO 8859-1 (it merely includes ASCII in the lower part
and has Eastern European letters in the upper part, excluding
a lot of Western European non-ASCII letters).

However, the Polish letters (as well as the rest of the Eastern
European letters) do of course exist in ISO 10646, albeit not in
the same code positions as in ISO 8859-2.  This means that it
should be quite possible for you to produce conforming HTML with
Polish text (leaving aside for the moment the issue of which
browsers are able to display it).

Unless I'm mistaken, "¡" is a "numeric character reference"
in HTML terminology, and since it must agree with ISO 10646, it
always implies an inverted exclamation mark (¡), never
anything else (such as Ą as suggested above).  Therefore,
I believe the numeric references above are wrong.  In ISO 10646,
Polish letters have codes above 255 (my Unicode book is at home
so I can't easily look them up right now, but they can be found
elsewhere, probably at ).

Because of this, I assume that what you tried in Netscape were
the symbolic rather than the numeric references.  I believe they
are correct with respect to the SGML standard (SGML is a more
generic format which includes HTML as one application), but they
are neither specified nor required by the HTML 2.0 standard (I
haven't checked the 3.0 draft, but I believe it hasn't become an
RFC yet, so I don't consider it definitive).  HTML 2.0 provides
symbolic names for ISO 8859-1 characters only.

The symbolic references are included as a convenience to the HTML
author, but it should always be possible to use numeric references
as a safe "last resort" (for instance, some browsers initially
implemented symbolic references for letters only, meaning that
for instance the copyright symbol, ©, had to be referenced
numerically by means of ©).

Now, making your document comply with HTML 2.0 doesn't mean that
every HTML 2.0 compliant browser can also display it properly!
From section 1.2.3, "User Agents":

   An HTML user agent conforms to this specification if:

[...]

        * It supports the `ISO-8859-1' character encoding scheme and
        processes each character in the ISO Latin Alphabet No. 1 as
        specified in 6.1, "The HTML Document Character Set".

            NOTE - To support non-western writing systems, HTML
            user agents are encouraged to support
            `ISO-10646-UCS-2' or similar character encoding
            schemes and as much of the character repertoire of
            [ISO-10646] as is practical.


Note that in this sense, NCSA Mosaic conforms quite well, since
it supports ISO 8859-1, and support for ISO 10646 (or anything
else beyond ISO 8859-1) isn't required.  I haven't checked to
what extent Netscape supports ISO 10646, but it's quite likely
still partial.  Support for ISO 10646 is a pretty complex task,
you see.  This is a more general feature than a mere Netscapism,
but you can't rely on the majority of browsers to keep in pace
with Netscape, and Mosaic is still up to date with "official"
HTML.  Your requirements simply go beyond that.

Please note also that even Netscape may behave differently on
different platforms.  For most of ISO 10646, you'd need support
from the underlying environment, such as screen and printer fonts.
You may be talking about Netscape for MS Windows, or is it Unix?
I certainly don't have many ISO 8859-2 fonts (let alone Chinese)
in my X11 environment; will Netscape provide them?  Thus you have
to be careful when estimating the percentage of WWW users who will
view your documents in exactly the same fashion as you do.

It may very well be that the platform will be more important than
the choice of browser vendor with respect to ISO 10646 support,
and the phrase "this page is best viewed with Netscape" will be
phased out in favor of "this page is best viewed on a Windows NT
machine in Japan".  We'll see. ;-)
--
Anders Andersson, Dept. of Computer Systems, Uppsala University
Paper Mail: Box 325, S-751 05 UPPSALA, Sweden
Phone: +46 18 183170   EMail: andersa@DoCS.UU.SE


Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 17:57:09 -0800
Message-Id: <199602230157.RAA03911@desiree.teleport.com>
X-Sender: jmurphy@mail.teleport.com
X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: CAnder2749@aol.com
From: Jeff Murphy 
Subject: Re: genweb project
Cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU

At 04:42 PM 2/22/96 -0500, you wrote:
>Jeff, what is the Genweb project referred to in your Bellah msg?  Is it
>something I can use/help? connie
>

Genweb is a group of people who are mostly software developers who are
trying to agree on a way to handle the problems of getting databases
available on the net.  What they are haggling over are things like: 

Can a database be stored at a single location, but yet be accessible to html
generators, so that the data can show up in more than one format?

How can databases which have common individuals best be linked, so that if
they occur in two different databases the user can be made aware of each
location, and possibly switch to the other URL with a single click of the mouse?

What is the most effective way to store data so that html screens can be
produced?  Should the data be passed through once to generate the screens,
or should it be done "on the fly"?

I'm not a software developer, although that was my job when I was a "real"
person.  My interest in all this is in making my database available to the
widest audience at least cost to everyone?

Everyone seems to have different agendas.  But by talking about the things
we each see as priorities, we help each other refine our thinking, and keep
from rebuilding the wheel.

 
Jeff Murphy                      Redmond, Oregon
Muhlenberg Co., KY genealogy: http://www.teleport.com/~jmurphy/
subscribe to PAFHELP-L at majordomo@teleport.com



To: genweb@UCSD.EDU
From: ghoffman@UCSD.EDU (Gary Hoffman)
Organization: IR/PS UC San Diego, La Jolla CA 92093-0519
Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 22:17:34 PDT
Subject: You are tuned to GenWeb - Do not reply

Anyone receiving this message is one of over 500 people 
subscribed to the e-mail mailing list GENWEB.

The purpose of this list is to facilitate the development of 
a linked, worldwide distributed genealogy database. 

If this topic is not of interest to you ...
here is how to unsubscribe:

   Send an e-mail message to listserv@ucsd.edu
   In the body of the message put the words: UNSUB GENWEB

That's all.
Do not reply to this message.
Do not send these commands to genweb@ucsd.edu.
Do not send me a message about unsubscribing.
Just do it as outlined above.

If you still want to read about the GenWeb, please point your WWW browser
to the URL
   http://demo.genweb.org/genweblist/genweblist.html
All current and archived messages are there for your perusal without
cluttering your mailbox.

Thanks,
Gary

***************************************************************************
*Gary B. Hoffman, Computing Services Manager     e-mail: ghoffman@ucsd.edu*
*Graduate School of International Relations and Pacific Studies    (IR/PS)*
*University of California, San Diego (UCSD)          voice: (619) 534-1989*
*9500 Gilman Dr., La Jolla, CA 92093-0519 USA          fax: (619) 534-3939*
***************************************************************************



Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 11:43:50 -0800
Message-Id: <199602261943.LAA21288@desiree.teleport.com>
X-Sender: jmurphy@mail.teleport.com
X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: genweb@UCSD.EDU
From: Jeff Murphy 
Subject: Gene Stark's GenWeb Index

Gene: thought this would be of general interest, so I'm asking here rather
than privately.

As more and more people put their data on the Web, I'm wondering if they are
also arranging to include their data in your index?  Many of them are
unaware of the index, and I was curious as to how "first contact" was handled.

It seems to me that it would be a Good Thing if, when someone indicates they
are bringing up their data on a home page, that a standard contact letter be
sent them describing the volunteer efforts of GenWeb members, and
specifically the data required to be included in your index.

It also seems to me that this could be a lot of work, monitoring all this
activity via, say, ROOTS-L and making sure the person got the form letter.

So, I guess I'd like to know how all this is handled now - if you are doing
it or something similar yourself - and, if the burden of doing it would be
too much, if there might not be someone in the group that would be willing
to help do it for you.  And an occasional monthly "state-of-the-art" message
saying how many people are being indexed in how many databases would seem to
be valuable advertising, the end result of all this, of course, to include
as many databases and people in the index as possible.

This is only offered by way of suggestion, and not to imply that the current
system is in any way inadequate.  I'm just not sure what the current system
is.    Is there a faq?

Jeff Murphy                      Redmond, Oregon
Muhlenberg Co., KY genealogy: http://www.teleport.com/~jmurphy/
subscribe to PAFHELP-L at majordomo@teleport.com



To: genweb@UCSD.EDU
From: ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com (Elaine J. Cornell)
Subject: Re: Gene Stark's GenWeb Index
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 96 04:30:04 -0500 (EST)

>
>As more and more people put their data on the Web, I'm wondering if they are
>also arranging to include their data in your index?  Many of them are
>unaware of the index, and I was curious as to how "first contact" was handled.
>

Jeff,

I'm glad you posted your message to everyone.  Is there an index of
Genealogy Web Pages?  If so, how do I get on it?  I have had all my
genealogy on a web page for about two months now.  It gets over 500 hits a
month & growing.  

The internet has been a great source of information for me, but finding
everything that is out there has been an every day learning experience!  We
all need to be connected somehow.

-Lane


E-mail:  ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com
GENEALOGY PAGE:  http://jax.gulfnet.com/user_pages/ecornell/ 

Searching Surnames:  Adams, Arnold, Audley, Avery, Barnard, Barry, Bell,
Bernard, Browning, Button, Caquelin, Carr, Claude, Cromwell, Eastman,
Freemyre, Gagniere, Goodenow, Hardington, Hazemann, Hulet, Lanphear, Lipp,
Loux, Miller, Neuvillers, Newton, Payne, Pelletier, Pemberton, Pendleton,
Pierce, Price, Remington, Rogers, Sailsberry, Sayles, Sharp, Soales, Sole,
Stokes, Thompson, Tibbetts, Vaughan, Wales, Whipple, Williams, Wright



Date: Mon, 26 Feb 96 23:48:50 PST
From: Beau Sharbrough 
Subject: FW: HTML adapted to Genealogy 
To: List-GenWeb 
X-Mailer: Chameleon V0.05, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc.
Message-ID: 
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii


On Mon, 26 Feb 1996 19:00:52 -0500  Denis Beauregard wrote:
>I am proposing a first draft for HTML adapted to Genealogy.  Why this
>proposition?  I have checked a few Web pages with genealogies
>and found that to index a page, a software must know the format
>used by the web generator.  So, this first draft would allow any
>software to read a page, independantly of the web generator and
>page language, and to index various entries found in that page.
>
>URL is: http://www.cam.org/~beaur/gen/html_dtd.html
>
>Denis
>
>P.S. Can someone tell me the address to send this to the genweb
>mailing list?
>

Grapevine 02/26/96 23:48:50
================================================================
Beau Sharbrough      |        THE  AGGIE PLAYERS
   |    50 years of Theater at A&M
www.connect.net/beau | 
================================================================
 


Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 22:58:38 -0800 (PST)
From: Annelise Anderson 
Subject: Re: Gene Stark's GenWeb Index
To: ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com
Cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU
Message-id: <01I1OP8R1K1U00FJC1@HOOVER.STANFORD.EDU>
X-VMS-To: IN%"ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com"
X-VMS-Cc: IN%"genweb@ucsd.edu",ANDRSN
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT


>I'm glad you posted your message to everyone.  Is there an index of
>Genealogy Web Pages?  If so, how do I get on it?  I have had all my
>genealogy on a web page for about two months now.  It gets over 500 hits a
>month & growing.  

>The internet has been a great source of information for me, but finding
>everything that is out there has been an every day learning experience!  We
>all need to be connected somehow.

>-Lane

>E-mail:  ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com
>GENEALOGY PAGE:  http://jax.gulfnet.com/user_pages/ecornell/ 

There's a list of genealogies on the Web at:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~cgaunt/hpages.html

There used to be a list of html-type data bases on Tim Doyle's home
page, indicating methods used to convert the data bases.  This was 
interesting.  Gene Stark also provided a list of the databases and
the people who had created them that are indexed by his site, but this
too seems to have disappeared.  

It seems to me this is getting rapidly dehumanized.  I'd think this
is unfortunate given that the number of data bases on the Web remains
in the hundreds.

Matt Helm's Genealogy Toolbox also used to have a list, but I haven't
been able to access it for some time....maybe because most of the time--in 
spite of having Netscape and Web Explorer and Internet Explorer running
on one or another computer, I still like lynx.  

Annelise


From: JohnR238@aol.com
Received: by emout10.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA01979; Tue, 27 Feb 1996 07:50:00 -0500
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 07:50:00 -0500
Message-ID: <960227075000_232309836@emout10.mail.aol.com>
To: ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com
cc: genweb@UCSD.EDU
Subject: Re: Gene Stark's GenWeb Index

Not to steal any of Gene's thunder, because his index and project is
certainly needed and a very ambitious project, but I am working on another
index for genenalogists called GENWEBINDX.  You can download the latest
200,000 +/- names at:

http://home.aol.com/genwebindx

My project is to index all files of interest to genealogists that are
available on the WEB, both home pages and ftp files.  This goes beyond the
indexing done by most of the current search engines to actually index every
name in the files - not just the file names or headers.  It consists of
downloading every file and indexing it with a pointer back to the site where
the file is found.  I am adding 20,000 - 50,000 names per week and now have
approx. 2 million names indexed.

The number of sites are proliferating much faster than I can index them.  I
add approx. 100 sites per week to my list of sites I need to visit, but can
only index approx. 20.  Volunteer efforts are appreciated.  You can help in
any of the following ways.

1.  Send me your site URL - I'll get to it in a few weeks.

2.  Send me a GEDCOM of the names which are posted on your GED2HTML site.  A
GEDCOM is much easier to read than actually going to a site and progressively
downloading each page of the index and the GEDCOM is easier for me to
process.  You can either send me the GEDCOM as an attached zip file or send
an email where I can FTP the file and the URL of your top home page which has
the GED2HTML (or whatever you used to create the pages).

3. Send me  a list of names in the format

LAST NAME, First 

with a note of the page which contains the name.

To be included in my index the information must be available on the World
Wide Web, in FTP sites, or accessible from the net through Telnet, etc.  Thus
the scope of this index is not to index names of people you're searching such
as Cliff Manis' GEDCOM project unless the names have been posted on the Net.

I don't have the resources to place the entire index on the net in a
searchable index, although I would like to do that.  My best quote so far to
get the file up is about $3,000 for a server and then $100 per month for
connection to the net via a T1 line.  I am considering a subscription service
for searching the index on line - perhaps $5 per month or $35 per year for
access.  Your feedback on the idea is appreciated as well as suggestions on
where I may be able to post the index (and the search engine) for free.

For the time being, you can download each set of new names each week.  A new
file is posted each Monday morning.

John Rigdon
Web Index Master

To: genweb@UCSD.EDU
From: mbr@dadd.ti.com (Martin Roberts)
Subject: Re: Genealogy home page index/Gene Stark's DB
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 11:34:42
cc: ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com
Message-ID: 

In article  ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com (Elaine J. Cornell) writes:

>>
>>As more and more people put their data on the Web, I'm wondering if they are
>>also arranging to include their data in your index?  Many of them are
>>unaware of the index, and I was curious as to how "first contact" was handled.
>>

Gene Stark has a name data base. For homepages, Brian Mavrogeorge maintains
a list of individual genealogy home pages. It is at:

http://www.sfo.com/~genealogist/hotlista.html 
http://www.sfo.com/~genealogist/hotlistj.html 

You might contact him to add a link to your page.

Martin Roberts


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Subject: Home Page Index
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>The internet has been a great source of information for me, but finding
>everything that is out there has been an every day learning experience!  We
>all need to be connected somehow.

>-Lane


>( ecornell@jax.gulfnet.com)

>>There used to be a list of html-type data bases on Tim Doyle's home
>>page, indicating methods used to convert the data bases.  This was
>>interesting.  Gene Stark also provided a list of the databases and
>>the people who had created them that are indexed by his site, but this
>>too seems to have disappeared.

For a list of about 975 WWW genealogical Home Pages in alpha order by
author, see my Netguide
under Section I.6.
  index entry
    o Home Pages.

If the home page author made it easy to capture the surnames at the
site, I captured and included them in the listings. There is no
attempt to cross-reference allnames  because text string searches
will find the surnames easily.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
 George Archer                           Internet:   garcher@bix.com
 Author of NetGuide: Genealogist's Guide to Internet, an etext at:
 The NGS Home Page: http://genealogy.org/NGS/  or
 ftp://genealogy.org/pub/genealogy/NGS/files/NETGUIDE.ZIP
 or anon ftp: genealogy.org/pub/genealogy/NGS/files/NETGUIDE.ZIP
---------------------------------------------------------------------